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	<title>Comments on: Supply Limits</title>
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	<link>http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437</link>
	<description>Game Design, Programming and running a one-man games business...</description>
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		<title>By: Troy</title>
		<link>http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437&#038;cpage=1#comment-9953</link>
		<dc:creator>Troy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Dec 2009 08:36:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437#comment-9953</guid>
		<description>I feel this is a mistake  already the game is limited by unlocks .
and now there is more limitations placed on the player.
hopefully this will be optional .

there is more elegant and creative ways to solve this solve this problem .

im going to refer to master of Orion 2 .

in a game i was playing one time   the Antares attacked me mid game  so i really didnt have uber ships that i usually had .
 but i had a plethra of weaponry available to me.
 One being stasis beams  so instead of building a bunch of ships to try and defeat the Antares i built several ships around the ideology of quickly moving in and placing the Antares ships into stasis  so that way i could fight the fleet more easily and also capture a Antares ship. 

my points are  that i was limited in my response to the threat due to not having the resources necessary to  create a uber fleet.  but i was able to over come this because i was able to use clever design to defeat the threat because i had options available to me .

this is what GSB needs . it needs more player options  which means greater diversity in modules and hulls .  to create your desired effects you could create hulls and modules that are exclusive to one another  .

for example  we lay out several hulls 

assault class hulls  these hulls are designed to fit the heavy weaponry in the game . these ships have power bonuses and maybe even range bonuses 
they will have a drawback for they will be slow and easy to hit . i dont expect any plasma torpedoes to miss these ships less they are packing the requisite defenses. or better yet have  the following.

logistics class hulls  these ships are able to equip technolgy that enable accompying ships easier target aquistion maybe damge bonuses and of course defense bonuses .

Traige class these hulls are able to equip remote sheild extenders and repair systems these keep the fleet alive  they provide sheild bonuses as well equipping technolgy that remote repairs ships.

that would at least give you  fleets that should have at least 2 types of hulls in them . 

to get more frigates into battle there should also be hulls and modules designed in the same spirit  . they would be  designed to exploit weakness of the larger hull clases .

specialized ecm frigates would be a major pain  as well as logistics disruption 
also frigates that intefere with triage efforts and of course leathal antifrigate systems . 

that way people who use these in battles will be giving an advantage over people who dont 

so now you have very potent reasons to use at least three or four hull classes in your fleet.

and the final  which i feel is good enough is fighters and bombers these all ready seem pretty potent as is  so i see no need to radically change them .

so that should give you all the diversty in fleets you are looking for. 

of course its not easy :(  but at least it gives the players more options in creating fleets instead of limiting them even more. 

diversifying the modules and making them exclusive to certain hulls would give you the diversification in fleets that you are seeking .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel this is a mistake  already the game is limited by unlocks .<br />
and now there is more limitations placed on the player.<br />
hopefully this will be optional .</p>
<p>there is more elegant and creative ways to solve this solve this problem .</p>
<p>im going to refer to master of Orion 2 .</p>
<p>in a game i was playing one time   the Antares attacked me mid game  so i really didnt have uber ships that i usually had .<br />
 but i had a plethra of weaponry available to me.<br />
 One being stasis beams  so instead of building a bunch of ships to try and defeat the Antares i built several ships around the ideology of quickly moving in and placing the Antares ships into stasis  so that way i could fight the fleet more easily and also capture a Antares ship. </p>
<p>my points are  that i was limited in my response to the threat due to not having the resources necessary to  create a uber fleet.  but i was able to over come this because i was able to use clever design to defeat the threat because i had options available to me .</p>
<p>this is what GSB needs . it needs more player options  which means greater diversity in modules and hulls .  to create your desired effects you could create hulls and modules that are exclusive to one another  .</p>
<p>for example  we lay out several hulls </p>
<p>assault class hulls  these hulls are designed to fit the heavy weaponry in the game . these ships have power bonuses and maybe even range bonuses<br />
they will have a drawback for they will be slow and easy to hit . i dont expect any plasma torpedoes to miss these ships less they are packing the requisite defenses. or better yet have  the following.</p>
<p>logistics class hulls  these ships are able to equip technolgy that enable accompying ships easier target aquistion maybe damge bonuses and of course defense bonuses .</p>
<p>Traige class these hulls are able to equip remote sheild extenders and repair systems these keep the fleet alive  they provide sheild bonuses as well equipping technolgy that remote repairs ships.</p>
<p>that would at least give you  fleets that should have at least 2 types of hulls in them . </p>
<p>to get more frigates into battle there should also be hulls and modules designed in the same spirit  . they would be  designed to exploit weakness of the larger hull clases .</p>
<p>specialized ecm frigates would be a major pain  as well as logistics disruption<br />
also frigates that intefere with triage efforts and of course leathal antifrigate systems . </p>
<p>that way people who use these in battles will be giving an advantage over people who dont </p>
<p>so now you have very potent reasons to use at least three or four hull classes in your fleet.</p>
<p>and the final  which i feel is good enough is fighters and bombers these all ready seem pretty potent as is  so i see no need to radically change them .</p>
<p>so that should give you all the diversty in fleets you are looking for. </p>
<p>of course its not easy <img src='http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':(' class='wp-smiley' />   but at least it gives the players more options in creating fleets instead of limiting them even more. </p>
<p>diversifying the modules and making them exclusive to certain hulls would give you the diversification in fleets that you are seeking .</p>
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		<title>By: Tadhg</title>
		<link>http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437&#038;cpage=1#comment-9947</link>
		<dc:creator>Tadhg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Nov 2009 09:37:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437#comment-9947</guid>
		<description>Ugh. I mean I get the reasoning but it&#039;s also a limiting behaviour but won&#039;t solve the problem. So instead of having an optimal fleet 64 frigates, players will have optimal fleets of 12 frigates, 24 fighter wings and etc. Such things are usually handled better through build/resource and upkeep mechanics.

However what it sounds like is more you&#039;re worried about depth of the game. I don&#039;t think that&#039;s going to have an easy solution because the game is specifically telling me what the enemy will throw at me, it really does boil down to &quot;more rocks or scissors&quot; questions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ugh. I mean I get the reasoning but it&#8217;s also a limiting behaviour but won&#8217;t solve the problem. So instead of having an optimal fleet 64 frigates, players will have optimal fleets of 12 frigates, 24 fighter wings and etc. Such things are usually handled better through build/resource and upkeep mechanics.</p>
<p>However what it sounds like is more you&#8217;re worried about depth of the game. I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s going to have an easy solution because the game is specifically telling me what the enemy will throw at me, it really does boil down to &#8220;more rocks or scissors&#8221; questions.</p>
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		<title>By: oddis</title>
		<link>http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437&#038;cpage=1#comment-9946</link>
		<dc:creator>oddis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Nov 2009 05:24:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437#comment-9946</guid>
		<description>more diversified fleet = synergy bonuses</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>more diversified fleet = synergy bonuses</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Wilhelm</title>
		<link>http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437&#038;cpage=1#comment-9945</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Wilhelm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Nov 2009 05:12:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437#comment-9945</guid>
		<description>This feels sort of like a patch fix. Instead of &quot;every ship is identical&quot; you&#039;ll end up with &quot;every ship is identical, except for these other ships that are better because we had some neat components left&quot;.

I&#039;d recommend some kind of a balance system that really encourages variety and specializing. Perhaps hulls or modules with large bonuses to X while simultaneously having penalties to Y - if you want a bunch of repair ability and a bunch of guns, make it preferable to have a repairboat and a gunboat instead of two repair/gun ships.

Or perhaps some kind of diminishing returns behavior, where diversifying is actually useful rather than being suboptimal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This feels sort of like a patch fix. Instead of &#8220;every ship is identical&#8221; you&#8217;ll end up with &#8220;every ship is identical, except for these other ships that are better because we had some neat components left&#8221;.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d recommend some kind of a balance system that really encourages variety and specializing. Perhaps hulls or modules with large bonuses to X while simultaneously having penalties to Y &#8211; if you want a bunch of repair ability and a bunch of guns, make it preferable to have a repairboat and a gunboat instead of two repair/gun ships.</p>
<p>Or perhaps some kind of diminishing returns behavior, where diversifying is actually useful rather than being suboptimal.</p>
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		<title>By: Bluebreaker</title>
		<link>http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437&#038;cpage=1#comment-9942</link>
		<dc:creator>Bluebreaker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Nov 2009 00:26:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437#comment-9942</guid>
		<description>Good idea,
however I would like to point that might be an interesting idea to give player feedback why he/she can&#039;t deploy certain ships. 

Ex. 
You can&#039;t deploy more fighters/ships because you are out of pilots, ship icon painted in red.
You can&#039;t deploy cruisers because the map dosn&#039;t allow them, ship icon in dark grey.
You can&#039;t deploy this ship because you don&#039;t have enough money, ship icon in yellow.
And so on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good idea,<br />
however I would like to point that might be an interesting idea to give player feedback why he/she can&#8217;t deploy certain ships. </p>
<p>Ex.<br />
You can&#8217;t deploy more fighters/ships because you are out of pilots, ship icon painted in red.<br />
You can&#8217;t deploy cruisers because the map dosn&#8217;t allow them, ship icon in dark grey.<br />
You can&#8217;t deploy this ship because you don&#8217;t have enough money, ship icon in yellow.<br />
And so on.</p>
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		<title>By: CountVlad</title>
		<link>http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437&#038;cpage=1#comment-9941</link>
		<dc:creator>CountVlad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Nov 2009 23:24:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/?p=437#comment-9941</guid>
		<description>Hey, that sounds like a pretty cool feature!
Another thing I thought of today which could improve the visual variety, though it might be hard to implement, is paint schemes. It would be cool if you could select how the ship is painted from a selection of paint schemes. I guess the way it would have to work would be for each hull to have several different graphics and for the game to just use the graphic that is selected. If someone made a custom scheme for one of their ships and then put a scenario using it onto the challenges list and another person didn&#039;t have the graphic, the game could just pick another random one.
On the subject of custom ones, it would also be cool to have a basic paint scheme editor in-game, but I guess that would be a bit too time consuming when other tools are already available.
Looking forward to the expansion! :D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey, that sounds like a pretty cool feature!<br />
Another thing I thought of today which could improve the visual variety, though it might be hard to implement, is paint schemes. It would be cool if you could select how the ship is painted from a selection of paint schemes. I guess the way it would have to work would be for each hull to have several different graphics and for the game to just use the graphic that is selected. If someone made a custom scheme for one of their ships and then put a scenario using it onto the challenges list and another person didn&#8217;t have the graphic, the game could just pick another random one.<br />
On the subject of custom ones, it would also be cool to have a basic paint scheme editor in-game, but I guess that would be a bit too time consuming when other tools are already available.<br />
Looking forward to the expansion! <img src='http://positech.co.uk/cliffsblog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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